Overview
The Bible consistently talks about God and Jesus as two distinct Persons. In other words, Jesus is not God. The Old Testament identifies God as the Creator. Jesus never claimed to be the Creator. He has always credited God with creation.
The New Testament adds that Jesus created all things but consistently describes God as the primary Creator and the Son as the Means through whom God created, for whom also everything was created (Heb 1:1-3; Col 1:15-17; John 1:1-3; 1 Cor 8:6; Rev 4:-11).
Since God created all things through His Son, His Son has always existed.
Discussion
| God and Jesus are two distinct Persons. |
The Bible consistently talks about God and Jesus as two distinct Persons. For example, at the beginning of every New Testament letter, the reader will find statements such as:
“Grace to you and peace from God our Father
and the Lord Jesus Christ” (Eph 1:2).
In other words, Jesus is not God.
| The Old Testament identifies God as the Creator. |
For example:
“In the beginning God created
the heavens and the earth” (Gen 1:1).
“Thus says the LORD … ‘I, the LORD,
am the maker of all things,
Stretching out the heavens by Myself
And spreading out the earth all alone’”
(Isaiah 44:24; cf. 42:5; 45:18).
As the capital letters indicate, “LORD” translates God’s name, YHVH, pronounced as Yahweh or Jehovah.
| Jesus confirmed that God is the Creator. |
Jesus never claimed to be the Creator. He has always credited God with creation. For example:
“Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female” (Matt 19:4-6)?
| Psalms 102 identifies God as the Creator, and Hebrews 1 applies that to the Son. |
Psalms 102 identifies God as the creator of the earth and the heavens. Hebrews 1 applies those three verses nearly word-for-word to Jesus, implying that Jesus is the Creator God. Show More
| However, Hebrews 1 also says God created all things THROUGH His Son. |
Earlier in Hebrews 1, we read:
“God … in these last days has spoken to us in His Son …
through whom also He made the world.
And He is the radiance of His glory
and the exact representation of His nature,
and upholds all things by the word of His power”
(Heb 1:1-3).
These verses identify the Father alone as God and as the Creator while “His Son” is the Means “through whom” God created “the world.” This passage also describes “His Son” as “the exact representation of His nature” (Heb 1:3).
| In Hebrews 1, the Son upholds the universe through God’s power. |
In Hebrews 1:3, who “upholds all things?” (Heb 1:3)? The word “His” appears four times in Hebrews 1:1-3:
1:1 God … 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son … 3 He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power.
Since the first three “His”-phrases in these verses all refer to God, the fourth also refers to God. The phrase “upholds all things by the word of His power” thus means that “His Son” “upholds all things by the word of” God’s “power.”
| Colossians 1 confirms that the Father is the primary Creator and His Son His Means. |
Colossians 1:15-17 is very similar to Hebrews 1:1-3:
“His beloved Son … is the image of the invisible God …
by (Gr. en = in) Him all things were created …
all things have been created through Him and for Him.
He is before all things, and in (Gr. en = in) Him all things hold together.” (Col 1:13-17)
Both passages:
(1) Refer to the Father as “God” and to Christ as “His Son” (Col 1:13, 15; Heb 1:1-2).
(2) Identify the Father as the Creator and the Son as the Means through whom God created all things (Col 1:16; Heb 1:2). Show More
(3) Describe the Son as the Image of God (Col 1:15; Heb 1:3).
(4) Identify the Son as the Means through whom God holds all things together. Show More
(5) Say that everything has been created for the Son. Show More
The similarity of the two passages is quite remarkable. Perhaps Paul wrote both. But the main point, for the current article, is that God is the Creator while His Son is the Means through whom He created “all things.”
| In John 1 also, God is the Creator but brought all things into being “through” His Son. |
We find the same message in John 1. The first verse in the Bible reads:
“In the beginning God created
the heavens and the earth” (Gen 1:1).
John referred to that event when he wrote:
“In the beginning was the Word …
All things came into being through Him,
and apart from Him nothing came into being” (John 1:1-3).
“The Word” is Jesus (cf. John 1:14). “The beginning” was when all things were brought into being (cf. Col 1:16). In this passage, we again find that God is the Creator and that He brought all things into being “through Him” (John 1:3).
| 1 Corinthians 8:6 says we only have one God, the Father, who made all things. |
This is a key passage because it is clear and concise, summarizing the principles above:
| There is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we exist for Him; |
And one Lord, Jesus Christ, By whom are all things, And we exist through Him. |
In this translation (NASB), all things are “by” the Son, which may give the impression that He is the primary Creator. However, the word in Greek is “di’,” which Strongs explains as “a primary preposition denoting the channel of an act, through.” (See Interlinear.) In Young’s Literal Translation, therefore, all things are “through” the Son. Show More
However, Trinitarians claim that this verse divides the words of the Shema between the Father and the Son, thereby including the Son in the ‘divine identity.’ For a discussion, see – the Shema.
| The beings in heaven glorify God alone as the Creator. |
Revelation 4 describes God’s throne room without Jesus present (Read Article). Jesus only enters the room in Revelation 5:6. While Jesus is still absent, the heavenly beings glorify God as the One who created all things. They:
“Will cast their crowns before the throne, saying,
‘Worthy are You, our Lord and our God,
to receive glory and honor and power;
for You created all things,
and because of Your will they existed,
and were created‘” (Rev 4:10-11).
Later in Revelation, in the context of the Mark of the Beast (Rev 13:16), a special message will proclaim that the Father, the Creator, alone must be worshiped (Rev 14:6, 7). Show More
| Man had been created in the image of the Son. |
The phrases “through Him” and “through whom” in John 1:3, Colossians 1:16, and Hebrews 1:2 indicate that God is the Creator, but He created all things through “His Son.” With this information, we can return to Genesis 1, where God said, concerning the creation of Adam and Eve:
“Let us make man in our image,
after our likeness” (Gen 1:26).
The next verse says that Adam was created in the image of God (Gen 1:27). This implies that, in verse 26, God spoke to His Only Begotten Son who, before His incarnation, “existed in the form of God” (Phil 2:6). And since God is invisible (Col 1:15), man was made in the image of the Son.
Conclusions
| Since God created all things through His Son, His Son always existed. |
Since God created all things through His Son, His Son “is before all things” (Col. 1:17). Since God even created time “in the beginning” through the Son, there was no time when the Son did not exist. He is “from long ago, from the days of eternity” (Micah 5:2).
Since God does not exist in time, there is no such thing as God’s first creation.
| God created the universe and everything in it through His Son. |
According to Hebrews 1:2, God made “the world,” but then verse 3 continues and says that His power upholds “all things.” “The world” in verse 1, therefore, means “all things.” Colossians 1:16 defines “all things” as:
“all things …
both in the heavens and on earth,
visible and invisible,
whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities.”
Therefore, the “all things” that God created through His Son include the universe and everything in it.. Show More
I know that there is no way that I have found to prove what I am going to say but maybe there will be understanding anyway. The spirit that would come to be known as the Son of God was preeminent while being a part of God as were all the spirits of man. The Son was not the Son until He was begotten, not just physically but spiritually at Jordan. If this holds up then the preeminent Spirit that has come to be known as the Son was of a group of spirits that were chosen of God from within Himself to be His children. Consider the rib of Adam was used to make eve as there was nothing in the creation worthy of being made the help mate of Adam except that that was within Adam. In like fashion there was nothing worthy of Gods children to be made from except that that was from within God, like individual cells of His heart or rib.
Noting Rev 3:14 Jesus refers to Himself as the “Beginning of the creation of God” This would infer to me that as He was taken from among that group of spirits and born a man and again spiritually, He became the first spiritually begotten Son of the Father. He was GIVEN life to have within Himself, which implies that He did not have that life within Himself until after it was given, thus He was not an independent spiritual being until after He was perfected. Even He was sustained by the power of the Father.
Obviously I am not a Trinitarian but in search of understanding and this is the only meaningful understanding that has been revealed as of yet. I seem to always find myself in the anti trinitarian camp defending the fact that God cannot die, thus Jesus was not God, and as He was the beginning of the creation of God according to His own words, He did not create Himself so……..
I would not agree with your views, but perhaps you can look up Dale Tuggy at TRINITIES. In some respects, his views are similar to yours.
I really love your insight. For years, it was as if I was alone in this kind of understanding. Let me share mine in addition to what you have stated.
To understand the spiritual, one must first understand the physical. The physical is rooted in the spiritual, hence operates in the same principles governing the spiritual. The word son, means a generation from a father. The seed(spermatozoa), was always a cell of the father, having the complete nature, memories, consciousness and awareness of the father, since cells form tissue, tissues form organ, organs form system, while systems form the body. Likewise the awareness, memories, nature and consciousness of the body spreads from across all cells, tissues, organs and systems.
God is the Father of all spirits. All spirits before creation, existed in Him as His own personal spirit-cells. Thus, having His complete nature, memories, awareness and consciousness. But in creation, God decided to generate all manner of beings, both spiritual beings, physical beings and Dual beings(these are beings that can exist and function in both the spiritual and physical at the same time). One thing these beings have in common is the Breath of God or the Breath of Life. This Breath is the the spirit-cells of God. When God moles the body whether physical body or spiritual body, He goes further to breathe into it His seed/cell/breath, then a new being is born. This new being has the the complete nature of God but doesn’t have the full stature of God. According to the physical realm, newborns have the complete nature of a human being yet, they are not yet in the full stature of their father. Though they are humans, but in their little stature, they can’t do and operate in the capacities and capabilities of their father. They have to grow until they reach/attain fullness of stature. At the full stature, they can now operate in all the capacities of their father. They can physically carry any weight that their father can carry, run as fast as their father, at this stage they are the perfect express image and representation of their father yet distinct from their father.
When God decided to create, He reached down inside His spirit-cells, and through one of His cells created all things. This particular cell through/by which He created all things is the seed and spirit of Christ. When the Holy Ghost came upon Mary, this same spirit-cell/spermatozoa by which He made all things was released into the physically moulded body of Jesus that was in the womb of Mary, just as in Gen2:7 He breathed into the nostrils of Adam. So the child in the womb received a new breath, though the physical body was from the fallen Adam. Her mother’s egg was the raw materials for His physical body. So His physical body came from the fallen man, but the breath, spirit, breath of life, soul was fresh from God. Then He started growing until He attained the full stature of His Father. Note Luke2:40,52; Col1:19, 2:9.
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